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    Old 11-28-2010, 09:08 PM
    bigsooz bigsooz is offline
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    Default Calling softcore members!

    I was shocked to discover that our account is now knocking on for 4 years. For the last year or so we've been a member of PCG. And jolly good it's been too.

    At the start we were able to commit to the excellent raids led by Akee and Sunday night became a time to be relished.

    However, when ICC really kicked in we found we couldn't commit the time required to keep up with the pace. We fell behind, we stopped getting invited and eventually slipped into a backwater.

    Although some ICC raiding was achieved we ruefully look on at guild kingslayers and think what might have been.

    If we have a criticism of PCG it's that it caters for the hardcore gamer but not, as I'd term them, the softcore. These are people who, for commitments in RL cannot make the regular times for the regular runs but never the less want to experience the thrill of things like ICC.

    I'm sure there are other gamers in this situation (the ever effervescent Katong to name but one).

    So to any softcore gamers reading this I ask if you would like to form an informal raiding group. I'm not aksing for official calendar recognition just an opportunity to gather a few like-minded PCG players to raid and not miss out a huge chunk of the best part of WOW gaming experience. Otherwise I fear that my personal interactive gaming experience in this guild will be the occasional 'gz' from the elite zealots and the odd begrudging invite.

    Anyone interested in joining this loose band of buccaneers please post here.

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    Old 11-28-2010, 10:14 PM
    Archernick Archernick is offline
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    Join Date: Jul 2010
    Location: North Yorkshire
    Posts: 523

    I can see how you feel but i think your looking at it the wrong way. When the PCG guild started to raid it only had one or two teams. Since then the leadership has seen the need of the many and has created many many more. It is almost certain that there is going to be some players that are going to miss out, it's un-avoidable. However PCG has done a great deal to minimize that.

    People who can't play WoW as often as the others commonly miss out on end-game content, or at least regular experience of it. By all means im sure people would be more than happy if you wanted to set up another team for the "Softcore" player's, your only problem is that it will be difficult to get a team together if your team consists of people who don't play often (for obvious reasons).

    The best way to solve this is for "Softcore" players to join in on regular raids that are held, Your going to have to comprimise some way or another. Talk to the leadership and see if you can work something out.
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    Old 11-29-2010, 06:28 AM
    Arobein Arobein is offline
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    Join Date: Jun 2010
    Location: Eboracum, Britland
    Posts: 1,432

    Bigsooz, I suggest we bug Teem in creating a new tab on our Ventrillo and call it "Up for raiding now". When people log on and feel like raiding they could get on Vent and check who else is in there. When they get enough people to form a raid they could go ICC or Ulduar or whatever. It is much easier than asking in guild chat as you never get people's attention that way.
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    Old 11-29-2010, 07:16 AM
    greenbeermonkey greenbeermonkey is offline
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    Location: Guernsey, Channel Islands
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    Its hardly going to help your cause when you start calling the regular raiders 'zealots' A bit counter-productive?

    The guild offers raiding pretty much every night, they've tried to be accomodating in regards to supporting those members that wish to raid by offering advice on gear, enchants and gemming via this forum.

    I would further stress Archernick's point on joining in regular raids and that a compromise be made somewhere.

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    Old 11-29-2010, 07:20 AM
    Arobein Arobein is offline
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    The problem is that not everybody can raid in the evening or on weekends.
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    Old 11-29-2010, 07:20 AM
    Spectrus Spectrus is offline
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    It would be great if it was just possible to log on and find nine other people who wanted to raid that night. However, finding people with the right class, gear and knowledge of the encounters may be difficult. Also, their characters would have to be not saved to the raid.

    Unfortunately, I think progression raiding does require a certain amount of preparation and commitment to work. Even if it is just one night a week. This is just the way that Blizz have designed the game.

    At this stage in Wrath you can PuG most stuff, but even then you still have to have learned about the encounters before hand.

    There are lots of things for casual players to do in WoW, but unfortunately raiding is perhaps the most difficult to get involved in. Especially, if you have a really unpredictable schedule.

    Last edited by Spectrus; 11-29-2010 at 07:23 AM.
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    Old 11-29-2010, 08:16 AM
    Arobein Arobein is offline
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    Still there are no reasons for not trying to have casual raids though.
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    Old 11-29-2010, 08:16 AM
    Aphaeas Aphaeas is offline
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    Great to see you taking so initiative and leading the way to starting a new raiding team for those who cant attend the ones already running.

    Just a few words of warning: without a regular time/date it will be difficult to get people together, just logging on and seeing if 9 other people want to raid may get frustrating.
    Secondly, people who start 'softcore' raiding often get the raiding bug and want to start progressing further and hitting new bosses. This has happened with many teams, either transforming them into progression teams or they see people leave once they have geared up to join other team.

    I am not saying do not create the team as your experience may be very different. Akee has a good thread in the raiding section (if you haven't seen it already) for those who want to set up new teams. Obviously as long as you abide by all of the general guild rules then you will have the support of the guild and officers and we can help give advice and such as you need it.

    I think you have a point, there are a lot of people who want to raid but cannot with the hard core progression groups. If you think that you can lead the way in helping them get into raiding then go for it!

    If you have any issues or need some help, I am normally around, just send me a message or catch me in game

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    Old 11-29-2010, 10:22 AM
    Darieth Darieth is offline
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    We're always open to new suggestions, and to new people taking initiative. I'm a little confused about when you *can* raid, if we haven't been catering for you so far. We've been running at least one raid team every evening, plus a late night team twice a week, plus a daytime Saturday team plus an afternoon tuesday team. Unless you want to raid in the mornings, there has been a raid slot available. Many of these teams have only been made feisable by our hardcore raiders bringing alts, so don't be too quick to critiscise them, and to my knowledge these raids have rarely been oversubscribed.

    I'm not sure whether you were around at the start of WotLK or TBC, but raiding early in an expansion is generally more challenging than at the end. I'm often confused by references to 'casual' or 'softcore' raiding; if you mean raiding once a week, or at a different time to most raids, then that's perfectly workable. If you mean not learning boss tactics beforehand, not getting your gear enchanted, not speccing properly and not learning your class, then I'd have no interest in supporting that.

    I have never seen a guild that is as helpful to beginners as PCG; these forum pages are full of guides and advice, and any of our experienced raiders will happily help anyone who's just starting to raid. But the key point is this; raiding requires more effort, in terms of preparation and research, than anything else in WoW. Raiding once a week is possibe, raiding without effort is not. I'd never rock up to a raid and expect the other 9/24 people to pick up my slack. I suspect you would quickly run into drama and difficulty with the "just turn up and see if anyone fancies raiding" approach.

    *EDIT* Why not suggest a time for a regular once-per-week raid? It could be a daytime, it could be a weekend, whatever fits with your schedule, and then see what level of interest there is?

    Last edited by Darieth; 11-29-2010 at 10:30 AM.
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    Old 11-29-2010, 10:49 AM
    Belimawr Belimawr is offline
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    to be fair in wrath there where a few teams that had to take along alt's and often struggled for certain classes/roles, when I was running with team super on a Saturday it was very rare we had the same people 2 weeks in a row and this is the biggest problem with casual raiding, while you can do some content you are never going to get much progression if the team changes every week, so the rewards get spread out over a lot more people meaning it takes the team a lot longer to get geared for fights.

    so while you may get to see some content in a casual raid you probably wont see all of it, because as stated above most people will try to move onto the more progression based raids meaning you will never get anywhere, this was a problem with the ICC try out team, they did want to eventually kill the LK but because it was more relaxed on gear requirements and past experience, but a lot of people went to the group got gear and experience then moved on to other teams.

    also cata is only a week away, every single player is starting from scratch as far as raiding goes, so really there has never been a better time to try to get into raiding or setup a group.
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